Some would say not for the first time. Tim has made his choice to continue with the lie that Tony Jones and Monbiot attempted to sell to the Australian and world public. A lie designed deliberately to defame the scientist and scholar Ian Plimer. Essentially Tim Lambert, like the other two liars, has decided to claim that the volume of Volcanic CO2 release above and below sea level is about the same level. This lie is being used to claim that it is Ian Plimer that was lying. By making the above and below sea level CO2 release about the same they are able to claim that human CO2 production is 130 times as high as Volcanic CO2 production. An outrageous lie.
Now I gave Tim the benefit of the doubt. I brought this matter to his attention to see if he would back down from this lie. After all he may have just not thought about matters very clearly. He may never really have thought about the extent of underwater volcanic activity. Few people understand the massive extent of underwater volcanic sea activity. And after all Tim is short fat and stupid. And his stupidity particularly might have made this not so much a matter of Tim telling outright lies. But we could have at one time put this down to an oversight from Tim. Everyone has these oversites. Everyone makes mistakes. Things go over peoples heads. And many things go over Tim Lamberts head.
But no more. We now know that Tim has been made aware of this issue. He has chosen not to back down. We now know beyond the shadow of a doubt that Tim Lamber is a liar and is guilty of science fraud.
Here are the posts I made which prove that Tim Lambert has been made aware of this matter.
You people are just being ridiculous. Monbiot made an idiot of himself. It was Monbiot who refused to answer any questions on climate science. Whereas Plimer wrote a book on the matter and answered the questions in the book.
Plimer, during this rigup, made it quite clear where his estimate for volcanic CO2 was coming from. From the chemistry of sedimentary rocks. This was his proxy. The Monbiot/Jones idiocy was more than evident. Since they chose to make gospel a 1991 study that claimed that sub-sea volcanic emissions and open air volcanic emissions were roughly similar. A self-evidently ridiculous contention in 2009.
Did all of you not notice that it was George Monbiot who would answer no questions? Not real perceptive or scientifically minded are you? Did you not notice that it was Monbiot who merely deflected the fact that it was he who would answer no questions, by claiming it was Plimer who would not answer any questions. All he did was refuse to answer questions and claim frantically that it was Plimer. In other words this was a frantic leftist reversal from Monbiot.
Plimer gave us enough facts for anyone with a brain to see that the Monbiot and Tony Jones claim was utter idiocy. Since there are 240,000 underwater volcanoes, and 68000 kilometres of volcanic underwater rift zones.
So if industrial activity was to release 130 times as much CO2 as volcanoes. If this were the case as Monbiot, being a complete idiot and a liar, had claimed, this would be more than the CO2 output of a hypothetical 31, 200 000 underwater volcanoes and more than the equivalent of 8, 840 000 kilometres of underwater riftzones. That many riftzones ringing endlessly around the globe in such a way as we could never get away from volcanoes.
So it was Monbiot and Tony Jones, shown to be idiots on this matter and not Plimer. Anyone with any affinity for science would have understood that. What a Pavlov’s dogs you all are. Responding to an obvious rigup like this. Watch the show again and this time for goodness sakes use your brain. Stop being mindless zombies for once.
Posted by: Lamark | December 26, 2009 12:23 PM
Monbiot and Tony Jones have lied and claimed that humans put out 130 times the CO2 of volcanoes. This is a lie since it is based on the claim that CO2 output from below sea volcanoes and CO2 output from above sea volcanoes put out roughly the same amount of CO2.
So we have seen Monbiot lie about this. We have seen Tony Jones lie about this. And now we see that dhogaza is belligerently willing to lie about this.
The only person in this sorry mess not willing to lie is Plimer. He has an estimate based on the chemistry of oceanic sedimentary rocks. Thats not a lie. Its an informed estimate. So on the one side we have Monbiot, Jones and dhogaza lying. And on the other side we have Plimer using his expertise to make an estimate.
So we know who the bad guys are here. You people have got to get around the other blogs a bit more. Or insist that skeptics be allowed unharrassed on your site. This incestuous and blinkered approach leaves you open to explosions of lynch-mob hysteria. In this case against a brilliant scientist who was telling the truth. And on the other side of a debate there was Tony Jones and George Monbiot putting about brazen lies.
Tony Jones, George Monbiot and you are all supporting this lie. I don’t know or understand your leftist view of ethics. Its still a lie regardless of where it starts.
Its not acceptable for Tony Jones, yourself, and Monbiot to be supporting this lie and passing this lie on, and lying yourself, using this lie. You hide behind institutions since with institutions there is no-one the rest of us can hold responsible. This is the lefts entire technique. They say this institution said this or that. But institutions cannot make claims. Only individuals can.
Would you like to retract your support of this rubbish? Would you like to show that you don’t support this lie and that you accept that Plimer has made an honest estimate based on a single proxy?
Or are you going to belligerently continue with this lie, not knowing who the individual was, who chose to highlight a study from 1991, that clearly got hold of the wrong end of the stick?
Look I think dhogaza has made his choice. The record stands that it is Monbiot, Tony Jones, dhogaza and others willing to tell lies about volcanic CO2 release. And that Plimer has an informed estimate. We await a proper estimate. Don’t pretend to know the answer because you don’t.
So Plimers telling the truth. And those that back the 130 times story are lying. Now it ought not matter that I cannot find the culprits who control the websites at the USGS. The fact that I don’t know their names is just immaterial . So we see the main technique here. The lie starts by individuals, who don’t need to be named, since they hide behind an institution. Then the lie is continued. By liars. One of them not being Plimer.
All of a sudden we see the USGS being quoted everywhere as if it is some authority. Why? When the claim itself is just ridiculous. Unbelievable. You go to the wiki you cannot find a proper link on the extent of undersea rift zones. You go to scientific American you have another liar quoting the USGS. You go to Monbiots site and he is going out of his way to practice plausible deniability. You don’t see Plimer getting involved with any of this stuff.
If Lambert and the rest of you think Plimers estimate is wrong, come up with your own estimate. Simple. But don’t be lying and telling people that above ground volcanic activity is anyway comparable to what happens under the sea. Because this is a clear lie.
So lets have your estimates. Or your admission that you have done the wrong thing by Plimer. Its not OK to defame someone like this who did not do anything wrong. And who rather was set up with obvious collusion and the use of a brazen lie. Its not OK. You might think its OK but its not.
“So volcanoes originate from sedimentary rocks.”
Chris you just are not that smart are you? Not very bright. Not the sharpest tool in the shed.
“Let’s see … who do I believe … the USGS or Graeme Bird. That’s such a tough question …”
So you’ve made your choice to continue with this lie even after it was pointed out to you. Naturally one wants to give Tim Lambert a chance to back down on this matter. Perhaps the stupidity of the estimate didn’t occur to him. Perhaps he was rushed for time or something.
But if he isn’t willing to back down and admit the lie on the USGS website. Then he too will be a clear liar. I have confidence that we will see his backdown.
The video has been good in a way. Its separated the failed analysts from the thoughtful. The youngsters don’t seem to know just how much the pursuit of truth has been a life-long obsession for Plimer. He used to be almost an extremist about it. He treated a creationist rather badly. I understand his anger, but its unlikely that he would act that way over having now had the benefit of being witness to the far more crazy secular beliefs. This is a man who lost a lot of money in court cases as a result of him attempting to debunk a fellow who claimed he had found Noah’s ark.
Plimer was a bigtime skeptic back before the skeptics movement was hijacked by mindless leftists. He used to go around debunking feeble charlatans the whole time. The idea that his word would be doubted and a flagrant spoonbender charlatan type like Monbiot would be believed to me is just incredible.
Always when Plimer was talking I’d be listening. Always I was aware that he was a first-rate intellect. He was the first person I ever saw who described Conservation as an asinine concept. And proposed that we ought to rather focus on biodiversity. That might seem like old hat but to me it was quite a stunning shift of thinking at the time.
Posted by: Lamark | December 26, 2009 10:44 PM
Ok so naturally Lambert has wiped all of these posts. Naturally he would have plausbile deniability if he quickly chose to back down from the lie he has flagrantly been putting about. We will see if he takes the opportunity to do so. This of course would not mean that he didn’t lie. It would rather mean that he had been caught and yet was still in a position to deny it.
Postscript: Lambert being a clever, devious little computer dwarf, has now made it such that I cannot even read his website. Let alone post on it. Tim is not one for free and open debate.