Posted by: graemebird | June 12, 2010

How Do We Know The Latest Oil Spill Is A False Flag Operation?.

We know this for many reasons. The signs are all there. But in a nutshell we know this because this is not like any other oil spill disaster. This one can be switched off whensoever the perps decide the time is right for it.

The placement of any object, sufficiently heavy, with a mildly concave bottom, can easily stop this leakage. So it will go on as long as the perps want to continue with it and not a moment longer.
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From comments on this thread:

“False flag operation”? Seriously?

Yeah definitely.

“In 5,000 feet of water?”

Easier to maintain the current media near-blackout.

“Who, exactly, do you propose would have the resources to conduct such an operation?”

Covert ops. Halliburton. Working for the shadow government more generally.

The BP boss sold a lot of his shares just beforehand. It had to be BP one supposes. Since BP is the most heavily invested in greenhouse bullshitartistry. Watch their shares soar later on.

If this shadow government crowd can get away with a huge botch-job like 9/11 they have to figure they can get away with anything. That we are always going to believe it. So any plot, no matter how crude, may be tried on. The very clumsiness of its delivery may make it seem accidental. These are fundamentally public servants we are talking about.

You see if you haven’t seen total proof of these palookas subjecting us to 9/11, AND getting away with it, of course you aren’t going to think its a possibility. Even one year ago I wouldn’t have suspected such a thing. This crowd is almost certainly the people who gave us Barry Soetoro as a candidate that they were going to make sure won as well. Nothing is more suspicious than his election. The sheer hugeness of his campaign spending. The deaths in his congregation. The ability to slap down any question of his eligibility.

Essentially if this crowd is the perfect match between money-creation and covert operations, there is nothing they cannot get away with.

For four decades now the CIA has been able to give people fast-acting cancer. They have been able to shoot people with frozen poison that melts and gives someone a heart attack. There is really nothing they cannot get away with unless we all start getting a bit smarter about it. The ability to kill people is not enough. But if various networks have merged with the money creation power, and exert influence over media and the banking industry and outfits like NASA, then this all combined with covert ops is an unstoppable force, and as scary a deal as was the Soviet Union.

See Nixon. He pulled a few stunts that he ought to have been able to get away with. But the FBI had a fatwah on him and so they brought him down. But if the FBI, CIA, the money-creation-function, the global banking network, and the bigger media (ie all that type of crowd that show up at the Bilderberg meetings) are all onside ….. these guys can then basically get away with anything, no matter that they tend to be all-thumbs and stupid.

“Your claim is tautologous and unrelated to your point.”

Sure its tautologous. Its also pretty simple. If the object has no hole and pipe-fitting it has to be very heavy. If it has a hole and pipefitting it doesn’t have to be as heavy.

One fellow hired a plane and went out there to try and break the media near-blackout. He just saw one boat out there. Not a lot going on? Why go to a great deal of effort if its a fake-up, that you are going to maintain until not long after you get crucial legislation through? Your 5000 feet point makes it a beautiful thing. Now no-one will be confident about deep-sea drilling. Plus in the meantime you simply cannot get anyone down there to film what is going on. So they don’t even need to be going to any effort to plug it. They may be filming a freaking mud volcano for all the rest of us would know, and simply dumping oil at their leisure. How would the rest of us verify anything at all at 5000 feet?

The word just out from Bilderberg this year is good and bad. Good that these guys are panicking and that their global warming fraud has begun to collapse. The bad news is that they are turning desperate. For the first time with this crowd, war with Iran is on the agenda. I don’t like the Mullahs. And certainly I feel for the cloud of continual threat that they present to the Israelis. But we ought to resist any war with Iran because of the idiots who will be trying to promote it. Under the cover of war these morons will be out to eliminate anyone who threatens their current power. They are desperate now. And they are doing desperate things. This phony oil accident being just one of them.
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Last year Guardian reporter Charlie Skelton was mugged by the Orwellian reality of Bilderberg. This year he gives us his more considered opinion on these thieves. Bilderburgers cannot count Charlie Skelton amongst those journalists who have never heard of them. Bilderburgers cannot count Charlie Skelton amongst those journalists who think they are a rumor. Bilderburgers cannot count Charlie Skelton amongst those journalists who don’t think that Bilderbergers are serious people making serious decisions, and exerting serious influence.

And Builderbergers cannot count Charlie Skelton amongst their admirers.

Quite the contrary.

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Understanding where this potential conspiracy fits into ones view of the contemporary scene. From a comment on this thread;

Actually you need to make a port-of-call earlier than 9/11. Because it is the Kennedy hit “The Big Event”, that shows that BIG CONSPIRACIES are possible.

You wouldn’t think that Big conspiracies were possible. For 8 years I laboured under the notion that Big Conspiracies were impossible so I therefore concluded that 9/11 was foreign regime action.

So your order of investigation would be

1. The Kennedy hit. To see that big conspiracies are possible.

2. 9/11 … to show that a quasi-shadow government exists.

3. Then this current (I say) sabotage. Since without 1 and 2 the idea of 3 is totally implausible. You see? I admit it. That the oil spill was sabotage is entirely implausible without one having first come to accept 1 & 2. No question about that at all.

What seems to have happened is that these guys are emboldened by getting away with 9/11 and the great global banking ripoff. They are also in a panic over what otherwise would look to be the impending collapse of their global warming racket.

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Responses

  1. Australian economist Birdlab’s contribution to the debate:

    I SEZ:

    “The accident came on earth day. Also Lenins birthday. These guys are none too subtle.”

    BIRDLAB SEZ:

    Hahahahaha! Oil-spill a conspiracy!

    A TRUE INTELLECTUAL THIS BIRDLAB.

    We would want to see how much of what Alex Jones is saying here is true.

  2. – Sales of shares and stocks in days and weeks beforehand

    – Halliburton link, acquisition of cleanup company days before explosion

    – BP report cites undocumented tampering with well sealing equipment

    – Government uses disaster to push for Carbon Tax, Nationalization talk

    http://pakalert.wordpress.com/2010/06/08/evidence-points-to-bp-oil-spill-false-flag/

  3. Let me get this straight, are you saying that the US Government authorised the blowing up of of the Deepwater Horizon oil rig and then have deliberately not stopped the oil spill even though they could at any time, all in order to get a new tax implemented?

    WHAT DO YOU MEAN “THE US GOVERNMENT’?

    Is Obama behind this?

    I WOULDN’T THINK SO? HOW WOULD I KNOW? THIS WOULD BE MERELY ONE MORE HEADACHE FOR HIM THAT HE DOESN’T NEED. WE’D HAVE TO ASSUME THAT HE WAS PRETTY MUCH BEHOLDEN TO SUCH A GROUP, IF THEY CAN BE DOING STUFF LIKE THIS AND GET AWAY WITH IT.

    THIS IS NOT LIKE THE KENNEDY HIT. IN THE SENSE THAT THE SMOKE HASN’T CLEARED.

  4. How big an object is required to stop the leak? Since about half the flow is natural gas, how would a concave object not float up, at least bubble around and leak more oil?

    IF IT FLOATED UP CLEARLY SUCH AN OBJECT WOULD NOT BE BIG ENOUGH.

    Since the oil comes out at tremendous pressure, why wouldn’t it squirt out from around the edges of any object put on it?

    BEFORE THEY DRILLED THE OIL DIDN’T LEAK OUT OF ITS OWN ACCORD RIGHT?

  5. THEY ARE NOT LIKELY TO BE ALL JEWS RON.

  6. The idea would have to be that if people were stupid enough to buy into 9/11, even in the post youtube era, and completely idiotic enough to agree with the CO2-Bedwetting crusade, or to be okay about the banking heist ……

    …. then such perpetrators would be emboldened, knowing that there is nothing they cannot get away with.

  7. So, you tell us: How big an object would stop the flow now?

    IF IT LEAKED, THEN IT WOULD NOT BE BIG ENOUGH. IF IT DID NOT LEAK, THEN CLEARLY IT WOULD BE BIG ENOUGH.

  8. These people can drill oil without screwing it up. Nothing could be easier for them. If you look at this case, very cheap equipment, that could have prevented this, was not employed. Plus they ought to have been ready to stop any problem that occurred should they fuck it up. A one hundred million dollar investment maximum for the latter. I’ve heard that it was 250 000 dollars for the former preventive equipment.

    Nothing wrong with drill baby drill. Its really just a problem of these guys being unwilling or unable to fix the problem. Whatever investments that are needed to clean up the problem needed to be made in advance. Thats a one-time expense. So when they finally decide they want to cap it, then we will see what it took. And that is what is needed in advance. Whether that be a huge, heavy cone or pyramid, with a hole and a pipe-fitting on top, or whether it be something else, so be it. But you want the fail-safe equipment in advance. You want the equipment to deal with the problem, ready to roll, after the fact.

    Its not too much to ask, and its not even a big investment for these people. Further to that it could easily be a joint investment for a number of companies.

  9. “There are millions of people like Barack Obama, the eternal students of a vast lethargic transnational campus for whom global compassion and the multicultural pose are merely the modish gloss on a cult of radical grandiose narcissism. ”

    Interesting sentence by Mark Steyn. But doesn’t this relate to some of the cuckoo babies on the right? Malcolm Turnbull. John Humphreys. Mr Key of New Zealand. Any right-winger who is a CO2-Bedwetter. They need not be particularly like Soetoro. But they do correspond to the sentence above. Right-wingers who cannot be reached through reason.

  10. When trying to figure out who are the conspirators of the definite 9/11 conspiracy, and the presumed, or at least likely, conspiracy that this thread refers to, we see that its not plausible that its any one known organisation at work here.

    Obviously I’m not in the position to find out who the culprits are, unlike in the situation of the Kennedy hit, where 47 years on the smoke has cleared.

    The below is pretty much the best I can do. Something that started small, as a nexus between covert-ops and the financing and banking needs of covert-ops must have grown and become far nastier then anything anticipated. This nastiness must be unprecedented as to scale. The first place to look is anywhere whose books cannot be inspected:

    “Well thats because these guys have become marvelous at kicking the can down the road.

    Notice that the bank-stealing ( an extraordinary event that took everyone around the world by surprise) suddenly went worldwide. At the same time Paulson, suddenly resurrected the crudest, most idiotic version of Keynesianism, ever seen. This too went worldwide.

    How do we explain all this?:

    One suspects that somewhere after World War II your Federal Reserve became some sort of asset for covert ops. Or something similar behind the scenes must have taken off and metastasized.

    The iron law of secretive stolen money organisastions is that they reinforce their mistakes.

    So something has happened here. If the conspiracy theorists were ever crackpots well they are on the money now. And it doesn’t seem to be a question of any one organisation. It appears to be intra-organisational networks, and your Federal Reserve may be at the centre of it.”

    I would say that the Federal Reserve is at the centre of Big Conspiracies now. Whereas the CIA was at the centre of “The Big Event” aka the Kennedy hit. But Goldman Sachs has got many seats at this table.

  11. From Elsewhere:

    I don’t quite know what you are talking about.
    How long have you been laboring under this peer-review-dogma mental handicap?
    I think you will find that it is a modern symptom of politicization and corruption of the science. Rather than anything that was any near as strong in your youth.

    Here we are not talking of peer-review itself. But rather of this fairly new and strident peer-review-dogma.

    Surely on some level you know that you cannot be right. Perhaps a psychologist might be able to tease out why you are in such denial.

    There is an implication of all this that stands out a mile. For all your sources to buy this silliness, some deep corruption must have befallen the world of natural science. Something that perhaps was a big feature in the humanities but that hadn’t so fully infected the natural sciences.
    We see that priesthood dogma has gained the upper hand on its eternal tug-of-war with the scientific method, in those natural sciences, wherein commercial endeavor isn’t playing a huge part.

    You ought to live with it. You ought to accept that science is in a mess and activate your own reasoning muscles, no matter how atrophied.

    You say I cannot be right, since were I right, all these organisations would be saying what I’m saying. But I am right and they are saying obviously wrong stuff regardless.

    This is something to live with and accept. Since not any one organisation, nor all the organisations at once, can make the mid-ocean ridge go away.

    Its an inconvenient truth.

  12. Remember the name Andrew Maguire. An assassination attempt on him is evidence for the contention that bigshot banking and covert-ops are both part of some sort of nexus, in 2010.

  13. For some definition of “sufficiently heavy”, yes, but not for a practical one. Your claim is tautologous and unrelated to your point. In order to use the possibility of fixing the leak in this manner to show that it could easily be done if “the perps” had the will, you must crucially also show that a “sufficiently heavy” device could be practically built, delivered, and installed in a shorter time-frame than the already elapsed time since the blowout, or at least in a shorter time-frame than it will take to drill the relief wells.

    Remember that the oil is coming out under pressure, which would work to lift that dome or to make an opening or openings through the (weak, silty) seafloor around the bottom rim of it.

    “False flag operation”? Seriously? In 5,000 feet of water? Who, exactly, do you propose would have the resources to conduct such an operation? Are you also accusing that party of 11 murders and many more attempted murders in the sinking of the Deepwater Horizon?

    • Doug with great respect, an error in the safety valve of this rig was noticed weeks before the explosion. The operators wanted to stop the rigs operations to investigate and some BP executive said No. This was reported on 60 minutes (13/6/2010 NBN TV). The survivor had actually jumped from the rig (10 stories) to save himself. They had been pressured to increase more than they were already producing, allegedly stretching the operations safe capabilities when this fault was noticed. And it was because of a rig workers
      error, or deliberate sabotage?

      He described the meeting as purely a chest to chest bumping exercise, and no one was able to override the BP executives instructions. Now something stinks there. The wetlands in Florida are already being effected by the way.

      Also a week ago efforts were made to cap the drill head within 48 hours. According to BP spokesman, and obviously it failed. Yet commentators said it would take at least another 2 months.

      Now is this survivor telling porkies to shift blame or what. We will know I am sure (or he will be silenced or disputed but he is on record on the 60 minutes programme) but in the mean time, 13 million barrels of oil are gushing out into Gulf per day and spreading and people have lost their incomes in the area, and there will be many more incidents environmental damage in the future.

      I was almost brought to tears when these little fishing boats are now employed to help clean up the mess and they know their efforts are practically worthless.

      Not to mention the effect on marine life and birds, it is heart breaking. Some of the residents effected by this are saying their lives are ruined, and the Gulf will not recover for decades maybe 50 years.

      And if it spreads? Untold environmental damage can be created in the sea
      as well as on other landfalls. Bermuda for example.

      And what did one BP executive say. “We do regret this and want to stop it
      so I can get back to my life’ What a turd of a person.

  14. “False flag operation”? Seriously?

    Yeah definitely.

    “In 5,000 feet of water?”

    Easier to maintain the current media near-blackout.

    “Who, exactly, do you propose would have the resources to conduct such an operation?”

    Covert ops. Halliburton. Working for the shadow government more generally.

    The BP boss sold a lot of his shares just beforehand. It had to be BP one supposes. Since BP is the most heavily invested in greenhouse bullshitartistry. Watch their shares soar later on.

    If this shadow government crowd can get away with a huge botch-job like 9/11 they have to figure they can get away with anything. That we are always going to believe it. So any plot, no matter how crude, may be tried on. The very clumsiness of its delivery may make it seem accidental. These are fundamentally public servants we are talking about.

    You see if you haven’t seen total proof of these palookas subjecting us to 9/11, AND getting away with it, of course you aren’t going to think its a possibility. Even one year ago I wouldn’t have suspected such a thing. This crowd is almost certainly the people who gave us Barry Soetoro as a candidate that they were going to make sure won as well. Nothing is more suspicious than his election. The sheer hugeness of his campaign spending. The deaths in his congregation. The ability to slap down any question of his eligibility.

    Essentially if this crowd is the perfect match between money-creation and covert operations, there is nothing they cannot get away with.

    For four decades now the CIA has been able to give people fast-acting cancer. They have been able to shoot people with frozen poison that melts and gives someone a heart attack. There is really nothing they cannot get away with unless we all start getting a bit smarter about it. The ability to kill people is not enough. But if various networks have merged with the money creation power, and exert influence over media and the banking industry, then this all combined with covert ops is an unstoppable force and as scary a deal as was the Soviet Union.

    See Nixon. He pulled a few stunts that he ought to have been able to get away with. But the FBI had a fatwah on him and so they brought him down. But if the FBI, CIA, the money-creation-function, the global banking network, and the bigger media (ie all that type of crowd that show up at the Bilderberg meetings) are all onside ….. these guys can then basically get away with anything, no matter that they tend to be all-thumbs and stupid.

    “Your claim is tautologous and unrelated to your point.”

    Sure its tautologous. Its also pretty simple. If the object has no hole and pipe-fitting it has to be very heavy. If it has a hole and pipefitting it doesn’t have to be as heavy.

    One fellow hired a plane and went out there to try and break the media near-blackout. He just saw one boat out there. Not a lot going on? Why go to a great deal of effort if its a fake-up, that you are going to maintain until not long after you get crucial legislation through? Your 5000 feet point makes it a beautiful thing. Now no-one will be confident about deep-sea drilling. Plus in the meantime you simply cannot get anyone down there to film what is going on. So they don’t even need to be going to any effort to plug it. They may be filming a freaking mud volcano for all the rest of us would know, and simply dumping oil at their leisure. How would the rest of us verify anything at all at 5000 feet?

    The word just out from Bilderberg this year is good and bad. Good that these guys are panicking and that their global warming fraud has begun to collapse. The bad news is that they are turning desperate. For the first time with this crowd, war with Iran is on the agenda. I don’t like the Mullahs. And certainly I feel for the cloud of continual threat that they present to the Israelis. But we ought to resist any war with Iran because of the idiots who will be trying to promote it. Under the cover of war these morons will be out to eliminate anyone who threatens their current power. They are desperate now. And they are doing desperate things. This phony oil accident being just one of them.

  15. Great posts by the way Douglas. I usually just get mindless stupidity as criticism, rather than a serious conceptual audit. Very helpful. Very logical. On the first post it could have been myself from 7 years ago. If it was the second post, it could have been myself from 1 year ago.

  16. Now you’re making up news releases from the Bilderberg conference?

  17. I haven’t presented a news release of any sort. Get it together Ed. You can do it. Focus. Take unto your person, the fine example of Douglas. A fellow quite unlike yourself, being able to ask intelligent questions.

  18. Get it together, Graeme. I challenged you for a citation to that bizarre claim you made.

    A CITATION FOR WHAT EXACTLY? YOU CALLED FOR A PRESS RELEASE FROM THE BILDERBERGS. THE BILDERBERGS DON’T DO PRESS RELEASES IN THE SAME WAY THAT THE PRINCE OF DARKNESS DOESN’T MAKE HOUSE CALLS TO DRINK CUPS OF TEA. YOU HAVE TO RELY ON PEOPLE INFILTRATING THE MEETING. SO YOU WANT TO LOOK AT WHAT JIM TUCKER AND OTHERS HAVE TO SAY.

    • Ed are you still going on about things you don’t understand, and then slaying
      the messenger. Like the Medieval Warm Period existence. And dairy farming in Alaska.

      All you have to do is Google. Go the CBS 60 minutes text and videos, and see what you think.

      Then Google why Goldman Sachs and Tony Hayward sold substantial amounts of their BP shares weeks before the disaster, and then wonder why when Deep Horizon had just drilled another hole which would have increased their oil productivity, and then think.

      It’s not a very nice world, and since the Internet, we are learning (all us mere mortals that is) the shanighans that go on behind closed doors. And directly effect our lives. And how governments and politicians lie.

  19. Citation? What do you mean? Do you want me to consult a dummy whose made a pdf study or something? What do you mean “citation”.

    They claimed they tried to put a cone over it already. But ho ho. It didn’t work. Its not going to work until after the legislation is passed.

    Bear in mind Ed. Your thinking is so skewed right now that you cannot so much as sort it out that the Venter bacteria is an example of intelligent design.

    You might want to get a bit more grounded and then make a decent comment.

  20. Citation? Well I never. Think of the circular reasoning behind the citation rort.

  21. There was a media blackout, but not last night on
    60 minutes. They were allowed to report it. There was a video from anglers near the station at the time of the explosion. The oil spill is a global disaster it will take up to 50 years for the environment to recover. Gulf commercial fishing fleets are now employed to help clean up the spill.

    Now one of the men who was on the drill at the time, a computer expert and actually jumped off the rig and survived, tell us that there was a fault in a safety valve from a worker’s error. They wanted to shut the rig down to repair it but the BP representative would not support this. His bloody fault. They had been pressured before this to increase their input. And now the result.

    Obama did state on his address that he would encourage more gas and oil off shore drilling etc.
    He has suspended this now of course.

    Personally I have felt off shore drilling for oil is potentially hazardous, as has the transportation
    of oil by sea. There have been accidents, and
    deaths, and I feel the off shore rigs are potentially open to not only accidents but also sabotage.

    So far it has cost 1.8 billion dollars and they are in no way near shutting off the drill head. Certainly BP are guilty of negligence as they knew there was problems with the drill safety valve before this tragic episode.

  22. Conspiracy? Like 9/11 it is a cock up. Sure there
    are failures in the administration to abide by warnings prior to the attack. And that building next to the twin towers was already rigged for demolition.
    And the owner got 7 billion out of it, blaming the attack as the reason it had to be demolished. Or caused it.

    However, the pentagon, and flight 93 are also a mystery with allegations of a US conspiracy.

    Bit late now for a full investigation but the reasons being America was not prepared or ignored warnings to prevent it. Particularly when the air traffic control were warning of this and they stood down the military aircraft to intercede
    whilst the planes were not over a city.

  23. Focus, Bird. You made grandiose claims about Bilderberg meetings. You were channeling a press release that, so far as I can tell, doesn’t exist.

    FOR THE LOVE OF FUCKING GOD MAN. YOU DOOFUS. BILDERBERG DON’T MAKE PRESS RELEASES. THEY WERE AN OUTFIT THAT TRIED TO PRETEND FOR MANY YEARS THAT THEY DIDN’T EVEN EXIST. THERE HASN’T BEEN A SINGLE PRESS RELEASE FROM BILDERBERG EVER. NOT ONE. NOT EVER. IF I’M WRONG ABOUT THAT IT WOULD HAVE HAD TO BE IN THE LAST YEAR OR TWO.

  24. “Now one of the men who was on the drill at the time, a computer expert and actually jumped off the rig and survived, tell us that there was a fault in a safety valve from a worker’s error. They wanted to shut the rig down to repair it but the BP representative would not support this. His bloody fault.”

    Just one more “coincidence” along with the others.

    With 9/11 Bush Bunny, you have to be ready to really sit down and review the evidence all over again. We have video, witness and scientific evidence. There really isn’t any doubt any more that this was a covert-ops hit. Building on an Arab plan no doubt. But definitely an American outer-circle to it.

    I can prove it to you. But it would take some time.

    “Obama did state on his address that he would encourage more gas and oil off shore drilling etc.
    He has suspended this now of course.”

    Here we have the motive. He wouldn’t support offshore drilling any more than he would support overturning Rowe Versus Wade.

    He makes a feint towards that suggestion, when he no longer has a choice. Then the shadow government rig up this disaster. The disaster really has to continue until shortly before or shortly after the legislation that will give them even more control over everyones lives is passed.

  25. Can anyone even think of a similar disaster? A hole that cannot be plugged? I find the idea risible myself.

    In the past you’d have these oil fires. The Red Adair would show up, and he’d be raining down tonnes of water per second at the core of where the fire was. That would allow him to get in real close and place some explosives there. They’d blow out the fire even as they continued with the hail of water.

    Then there would be straight leaks from ships. Ships crashing. Straight leaks from rigs. But this hole-that-mysteriously cannot be plugged. This is really a new one. I’m not a believer in it. Not until they prove it anyhow.

    • Graeme said: “Can anyone even think of a similar disaster? A hole that cannot be plugged? I find the idea risible myself.

      In the past you’d have these oil fires. The Red Adair would show up, and he’d be raining down tonnes of water per second at the core of where the fire was. That would allow him to get in real close and place some explosives there. They’d blow out the fire even as they continued with the hail of water.”

      Ixtoc I was an exploratory oil well being drilled by the semi-submersible platform Sedco 135-F in the Bay of Campeche of the Gulf of Mexico, about 100 km (62 mi) northwest of Ciudad del Carmen, Campeche in waters 50 m (160 ft) deep. On 3 June 1979, the well suffered a blowout resulting in the third largest oil spill and the second largest accidental spill in history.

      In the initial stages of the spill, an estimated 30,000 barrels of oil per day were flowing from the well. In July 1979, the pumping of mud into the well reduced the flow to 20,000 barrels per day, and early in August the pumping of nearly 100,000 steel, iron, and lead balls into the well reduced the flow to 10,000 barrels per day.

      In the next nine months, experts and divers including Red Adair were brought in to contain and cap the oil well. An average of approximately ten thousand to thirty thousand barrels per day were discharged into the Gulf until it was finally capped on 23 March 1980, nearly 10 months later.

      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ixtoc_I_oil_spill

      So you see Graeme, it isn’t is easy to contain as you assert, or are you saying that was a conspiracy too, with Red Adair in on it?

      • Excellent. Good work Ritchie. Thats exactly the precedent we were after.

  26. Democracy subverters and shadow government aspirees making a press release. When I say aspirees or wannabes, it would seem that for the last few years at least, they really have been successfully in charge in a meaningful way. It need not be inferred that their influence had always been quite so strong. I don’t believe its an absolutist thing. I think its probably just a matter of degree.

    But the idea of these evil bastards making a press release when but a few years ago people would claim that they were a myth is pretty funny. Thats like Charles Manson declaring in advance that he intends to slaughter Sharon Tate.

    What would be the point of it? You would get around to Sharon’s place with your knives all sharpened and she wouldn’t be there but people with guns would be.

    Same situation for Bilderberg. These are elitist and eugenicist scum. They are not going to openly tell us what they are up to.

  27. “And that building next to the twin towers was already rigged for demolition.
    And the owner got 7 billion out of it, blaming the attack as the reason it had to be demolished. Or caused it.”

    Thats quite a lot of material pointing towards a conspiracy right there bunny-honey. You put the entire picture together you won’t be able to believe anything else.

    I took 8 years to come around on this point and would not have been able to do so but for very strong bandwidth addiction and the advent of youtube.

    What has happened I think, is we have come into a new age of conspiracy in the West. If you look at the 19th century, I would not see this as a time when intrigue was particularly important. But you go outside of the West and outside of the 19th century and thats a different story. You go to some times and places and intrigue is the normal way of getting things done and seizing power. Take the Byzantine empire for example. There was always some sort of plots going on there.

    Well it seems that this sort of thing has infiltrated the modern world. Not that it wasn’t always there. But now its here in spades.

  28. Birdy, I went through this years ago. It was a cock up and a convenient political one at the time I will admit. But I wouldn’t put anything past the Bush regime. Seen the DVD documentary ‘Bush’s first 1000 days’.

    Mossad commented at the time (Don’t mess with us you gentiles or Arabs at your demise) that Hussein was financing the attack, and Osama bin Laden, just got the publicity from it all. As Hussein and Bin Laden hated one another but assisting one another? With Al Quaeda and the Taliban supporting the attack it is a mess from start to finish.

    I can’t believe that Norad was shut down for the day when this attack happened. And the London
    attack was in a similar situation. Very unusual.

    I query the American response. I was married to
    a captain of the Vulcan V force, and they had
    QRA (Quick reaction Alerts) during the cold war.
    Any suspicious action of a commercial aircraft would have been spotted as soon as they strayed from their flight plan. Especially with all the air traffic coming and going in Washington and New York.

    People have excused the non arrival of fighter planes to shoot down those hijacked aircraft?

    Too far away? They travel very fast you know.
    And the air traffic controls were warning about
    these air craft 45 minutes before they hit the towers.

    However, Afghanistan is now a really big problem.
    They are infiltrating Pakistan that has 50 nuclear
    warheads.

  29. I don’t tend to blame the Bush administration so much since they are out of towners. But clearly they must have been co-opted in some way. From the way the CIA acted when Kennedy was around it seems they work by putting people outside the organisation in a position of blame. They so construct matters as to be able to shift the blame to parties outside of the CIA should they wish to. And that ties the others into the coverup.

    So for example the Kennedy hit could have variously been blamed on the mob, Johnson, Texas oilment, communists, and so forth.

    And 9/11 can be blamed on Arabs, Arab regimes, Mossad, the Bush administration and so forth. So being as the real culprits have managed to get everyones fingers dirty on a plot they probably had expected wouldn’t go ahead or would be a great deal smaller, then when the full horror of it is revealed, this forces all the fringe parties to maintain full secrecy on matters.

    So for example Kennedy was made to agree to getting Diem removed from power. He never wanted to see his friend and their whole family murdered. But the CIA would have had documentation of his approval to get this fellow out of power. From that point Kennedy can be blamed for the murder of Diem and all his family. Or alternatively they can throw the blame off onto the South Vietnamese generals.

  30. As 60 minutes did a good job of reporting this and
    pulled no punches one bit. Intimating that the spill is worse than initially reported.

    The computer worker. Yes I see your point. He jumped off 10 story high platform into the sea and survived. I felt a twinge of suspicion, as I did the
    video of the explosion from the anglers near by.

    Obama did announce in his address during what is it named State of the Union. ” That he knew that not everyone believed in the science of climate change. (Lots of laughter from the congress) But he wanted the USA to compete with China and Europe in clean energy industries.
    He included off shore gas and oil drilling, nuclear
    and also making solar panels. My jaw dropped.

    Since then he has announced that no more licenses would be granted for off shore rigs. For the time being. His address is available on U Tube.

  31. Right. There plans to take control of, and ration energy falling in a heap because of the global warming fraud now being apparent to a big cross-section of the population.

    The entire plans for total control were wrapped up in the global warming racket. So these bigshots weren’t just about to give it away.

    So out comes this disaster. Right on time.

  32. logged post from elsewhere:

    Graeme Bird :
    13 Jun 2010 2:55:12pm
    Supposing we would want to continue with the iron sun theory, but not with Manuel Oliver’s version of it. Climate rationalists, as a whole, have not gone down this path. But once you reject the big bang you have to ask where matter comes from. Not “stuff” but matter as we know it. Seeing as there is a great deal of space, and a relatively small amount of matter, it makes sense to suppose that the matter is made where we see it. “On-location” as it were.

    If that is the case then matter is being created where it already is. In planets, moons, and stars and particularly at the centre of galaxies. But this may be merely CONVERSION not CONJURING. It may be the conversion of “stuff” that we don’t know about and cannot detect into “matter” that is locked into the gravitational network.

    Under these conditions we would expect the most stable, and a heavier-than-average element, that is to say IRON, to dominate the centre of major bodies. This is not Manuel Olivers theory. This is just how I would look at matters. This is why I think our sun is indeed dominated by an inner iron core not unlike our planet.

    Reply Alert moderator

  33. Back to the Bilderberg saga. If you compare it with the UN IPCC debacle, and now blame being placed on fraudulently contrived data to support a world governance. You don’t think that some big manipulator thinks about the health of the planet as an excuse for control. As my astute ex once said when we were arguing about women’s lib etc. “Darling – what ever you think and do, the fact is this, the back pocket controls this world and everyone’s lives” (In other words the wallet in the hypothetical back pocket) Such is the control and circulation of big money, politics and global finances and there is competition in this between the West and Arab countries. Between the US of A and Europe, China and it is
    a mess.

    Who will benefit from ETS or Cap ‘N Trade, the carbon emitters. They just charge more for their
    product to the consumers. And why blame CO2. It does not effect climate.? Pollution yes but it is localised. Like this oil spill now.

    I didn’t like the BP executive, when asked how he felt. “I am sorry, but I want it settled so I can get back my life”. What a suggestion, BP should
    be losing value in their stocks right now, I wonder who really owns them.

  34. Not the boss. The boss sold a lot of his shares ahead of the disaster. Goldman Sachs sold most of their shares ahead of the disaster as well. BP is a company that prides itself as being heavily invested in green energy alternatives.

    Here is a particularly depressing video.

  35. BP had adopted the name: Beyond Petroleum.

  36. This particular spill bunny-honey. I don’t think its just a local problem. Thats the one place in the world you really cannot afford for this to happen. Since this is the origin of the Gulfstream. The flow of a volume of about 20 amazons, going all the way up to the Sea of Labrador.

    This is a killer disaster. It could put a great hole in world fishing hauls, and it could be one more sizable disaster when it comes to bringing the American economy down.

    I might start eating fish and chips while I still can. Because we might find a great deal more of our fish being committed for export to affected regions. The fish prices could go way up.

  37. Here is an animation of the original event from the first of May.

  38. I’ve done some Googling. US lease to BP. 27% owned by Kuwait, and the rest by the US? Seems the Gulf provides 25% of the US oil. And it stays in US too.

    But the hatred being spewed on the above website, blaming the British? Very good video
    one can now almost truly appreciate the extent of this disaster.

    The 60 minutes was also good. However, as you say the safety valve fault caused by a worker on the rig, is suspicious too. If it was that bad, then wouldn’t you think that someone would have told the BP executives to eff off and shut up and go ahead with repairs or investigations?

    They are losing 13 million barrels a day? But the Brits are getting angry about Obama blaming UK or British Petroleum and BP pension investments are plummeting. Then – who should take responsibility. I suspect it will be BP but like Exxon people are still trying to get compensation from them who were effected by their ship sinking.

  39. And what is frightening Graeme, say they can’t shut it off? It will eventually pollute the whole of the Atlantic? Then the the currents will take it into
    the Southern Oceans and Indian ocean. Mediterranean North Sea. Now I am getting worried.
    Maybe they should neuk it, no not that, ?

    Any suggestions.

  40. They just have to build a cone large enough and heavy enough to put on top of it. Then if the cone has a hole on the top and a pipe-fitting any leaks under it are going to be minimal once they start pulling the oil out.

    But I’m not convinced that they will want to stop the problem until they know they have the votes on that energy bill.

    The idea of the oil getting into the rest of the oceans probably isn’t a serious worry. I don’t see the oil downwelling in the sea of labrador, since the downwelling material is heavily evaporated salty water. And the sub-surface great ocean conveyor is magnificently slow-moving. So I would see it as a screwup that cannot really spread further than the east coast of the US.

    What would be very bad is if a film of oil sat on top of the Gulf-stream, and prevented evaporation. Which impeded down-welling. Which impeded the gulf-stream.

    Cutting off evaporation would mean droughts and the ocean warming. Yet the black on the surface may reduce the depth that the light can go and thats is a cooling influence too. So we have things working different ways if it gets that bad. One doesn’t know what will win out.

  41. As a catastrophic proposition try this:

    Enough oil is released so as to travel on the surface of the Gulf Stream all the way up to the sea of Labrador. Even if only as a pretty thin film.

    It impedes evaporation enough to make the warm salty water unable to sink below the colder, slightly less salty water. Or at least to do so at a vastly lesser volume.

    As a general proposition, impeding the Gulf Stream would bring on a new glacial period.

  42. Here is an example of the desperation to usurp power being employed at this time. Obama has Swot-teams in the department of interior. And he’s going to use them:

  43. Malaria and eugenicists who plead innocent: Logged post from elsewhere:

    Here is a bit of a truncated version of how hazards are dealt with under industrial safety. The bednets dogma, would be roughly equivalent to a reliance on PPE (Personal Protective Equipment) alone:
    >>>>>>>>>>

    Elimination (including substitution): remove the hazard from the workplace.

    Engineering Controls: includes designs or modifications to plants, equipment, ventilation systems, and processes that reduce the source of exposure.

    Administrative Controls: controls that alter the way the work is done, including timing of work, policies and other rules, and work practices such as standards and operating procedures (including training, housekeeping, and equipment maintenance, and personal hygiene practices).

    Personal Protective Equipment: equipment worn by individuals to reduce exposure such as contact with chemicals or exposure to noise.
    >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

    These control measures, as presented here, are in their correct order. The PPE is always the last resort. In the end we all wind up with steel-capped boots and hearing protection, since there is no way to make your feet safe through prior controls mentioned, and since having quietly running heavy machinery would be prohibitively expensive. But to rely on PPE alone would be just a disaster.

    So there is a real science to this sort of thing. Leftists in the public sector, who have lived all their life in the big city may delude themselves that they are right about this. It would probably be easier to shoot them then to talk sense to them. They are totally wrong. And there is a whole body of knowledge built up in analogous fields to show they are wrong. And the empirical evidence makes clear they are wrong, since look at all the kids their meddling has murdered!!!!

    You never fight on the defensive only. You never have one line of defense alone. You never rely on protective equipment and nothing else.

    I don’t suppose there is any use persuading committed irrationalists. We’ve just got to try and stop you people somehow. Its a bit of a shadow of guilt cast on the sane amongst us that we haven’t overturned you lunatics on this matter yet.

  44. Confirmation of Tony Hayward and Goldman Sachs selling shares in BP, as discussed earlier.

  45. […] https://graemebird.wordpress.com/2010/06/12/how-do-we-know-the-latest-oil-spill-is-a-false-flag-opera… […]

  46. Very good U Tube version. And I worry about the
    global reaction to this. On one blog, they are calling it Obama wages war on UK. Well Americans have never been the best friends of UK. As far as trading and competing with Europe for technology, that they often have pinched and promote their own.

    The prime example is the scrapping of the TSR2 (yes Graeme we have a wine similarly named) My ex was short listed to fly this coming off Vulcans. It was a medium range low flying bomber capable for flying under radar and delivering stand off nuclear bombs. Australia was to receive them initially, but would have had pilots trained in UK. They had a superior radar
    system and these planes were capable of sonic
    speed and could fly just 150 feet above the trees.

    And the Aussies are aligning themselves more with them, than with Britain nowadays. Well I thought Obama was better than Bush. But – I am wondering how much power he really has and who is pressing his buttons.

    However the F1 11 was the yanks deal at the time
    which was not in anyway suitable for Australia’s need. So they scrapped it, as there was no one
    to buy it from them. By today’s standards this would be a very effective plane.

  47. I feel Birdy, that the spread of oil will not be restricted to the Atlantic. It will take years to spread
    further than it has now. The Gulf of Mexico is near
    the currents and could effect Cuba and Bermuda
    and from videos can you see how wide it is.

    I know it sounds trite, but with the Exxon disaster, one scientist said, throw over the surplus wool supplies from New Zealand and the wool will soak up the oil and eventually sink. Stopping it from spreading. Then it can be scooped up.

    Need a hell of a lot of wool for this spill.

  48. Right. Notice that we didn’t even try to get hold of the Rapter. And when it came down to it, the defense minister of the time could not tell us why. This was Brendan Nelson.

    After the fact they justified this by saying “We could never get hold of the Raptor anyway.”

    Everyone has bought into this post hoc justification. But its a rewrite of history. Particularly since no-one can predict whether or not we could get hold of this plane. The pretense that we know the answer to this question is just nonsense.

    I myself object to sending our guys out in anything less than the best stuff we could possibly get hold of.
    >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

    As to Obama he is full bore scuttling the US and part of that is ruining its traditional alliances. Thats the logic of all his actions.

  49. The naked short-seller Cambria is a compulsive liar. To whit:

    “CL:

    No one has a problem with the idea that there was life on Mars. There could still be in fact.

    the problem is that Bird thinks we were visited by aliens who then had sex with earthing women who in turn had their babies.

    There could be a kernel of truth to that however having seen pics of him.”

    Nowhere on this blog or on the internet have I expressed such a belief. The dummy’s Cambria and Birdlab are suggesting you get a third species by having one species rape another. They are not big on biology these two. Rather better at compulsive lying then understanding biology.

  50. Well you get vexatious bloggers, they hide behind the internet and blow out their inner felt inadequacies
    on others, like some psychotic dream world they obviously live in.

    They feel they gain power from this and lends credibility to their warped world view. You are not alone dear chap. I have people who are so sick in the head, they have accused me of worse. Or even credited me with things I have never said in public or written about…luckily I still have supporters but it annoys me inwardly. As it is a form of libel.

  51. IT DOESN’T MATTER HOW MANY TIMES CAMBRIA, THAT YOU ATTEMPT TO MATE A GIRAFFE WITH A SNAKE, YOU WON’T GET ANY KIDS. YOU ARE THE STUPIDEST, MOST IGNORANT WOP THE WORLD HAS YET SEEN.

    • OBVIOUSLY NEW SPECIES CREATION USING A HUMAN MOTHERS GENES IS A TEST-TUBE CREATION. IT REQUIRES GENE-SPLICING.

      ITS NOT UP TO ME. IF A SKELETON IS FOUND TO HAVE DNA ALIEN TO THIS PLANET, AND YET HAVE A HUMAN MOTHERS DNA, THATS A HYBRID SKULL YOU MORON. ITS NOT EVIDENCE OF RAPE YOU STUPID FUCKING WOP.

      YOU ARE JUST SO PRIMITIVE CAMBRIA. SURELY THE MOST PRIMITIVE NAKED-SHORT-SELLER IN THE WORLD.

      • Sounds like Cambria has read my favorite author’s books ‘Next’. A chimpanzee and parrot given human genes. Written by the late Michael
        Crighton, who died prematurely. (Probably after his book ‘State of Fear’ was published prior to the UN IPCC fiasco and after Al Gores ‘Inconvenient
        Truth etc’.

        Michael was spot on in many respects about genetic enhancements etc.,
        and had the qualifications to back them up. Jurassic Park etc. Next particularly.

        LOL.

  52. Oh you were referred to on Joanne’s blog, ‘She was insulted in parliament section’ By dear old Matt B,
    and I never mentioned your blog.

    They don’t like their politics being exposed, do they.

    LOL

  53. Good golly, Mr B.

    That is one Stupid Fucking Cut we are dealing with.

  54. Yes Cambria is known as the most stupid of the naked-short-sellers.

  55. WHAT DO YOU KNOW ABOUT OPERATION MONGOOSE THAT I DON’T YOU STUPID GOOK ? YOU DON’T HAVE A VERY WELL-DEVELOPED CONCEPT OF REALITY OR HISTORY DO YOU? NO YOU DON’T.

  56. WHAT ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT YOU MORON? YOU AREN’T INTERESTED IN EVIDENCE. IF YOU WERE INTERESTED IN EVIDENCE YOU WOULD WATCH THE LLOYD PYE VIDEOS ON THE MATTER. THERE IS NO POINT IN LINKING ANYTHING SINCE YOU AREN’T INTERESTED IN EVIDENCE. YOU WOULDN’T UNDERSTAND THE EVIDENCE IF LINKED. FOR THE BENEFIT OF THIRD PARTIES I’LL LINK THE EVIDENCE.

  57. Look at this idiot Bird Flaps.

    Has absolute no understanding of how you go about Ranking Paradigms.

    Thinks you just pick One Paradigm and dismiss all the others with stupid fucking questions about test tubes.

    What the fuck do Test Tubes have to do with it you stupid fucking cunt.

    Christ I want to punch your fucking face in you stupid Wog Cunt.

    Fucking Test Tubes!!!

  58. Yeah he’s a blockhead alright? It just shows how easy naked short-selling must be if there is a gang of stock-market hyenas.

  59. Here is one interpretation of the strangeness of the oil spill news coverage:

    “In the litany of Web video, photos, and blurbs, and on the decrying of the evening news reports, this drama is simply missing. Where are the discussions of strategy, profiles of the leading engineers, descriptions of the ships and submersibles-even an accurate description of a blow-out preventer?

    Where (is) a discussion of the communications network that links equipment, crews, and engineers with live video?

    The sad answer, I fear, is that all this is missing because the news providers either don’t understand it themselves, or because they assume their audiences wouldn’t understand it.”

    It could be that. That could be the explanation. Or the hollowness of the coverage could simply come down to the idea that the conspirators are waiting for the legislation to pass prior to them declaring that the disaster is over.

  60. YES THE CANCER PROJECT WAS PART OF OPERATION MONGOOSE. IT WAS A SUCCESSFUL PART OF THE PROJECT AND LEE HARVEY OSWALD WAS DIRECTLY INVOLVED WITH IT. IT WASN’T SUCCESSFUL IN THAT THEY DIDN’T MANAGE TO GIVE CANCER TO FIDEL CASTRO. BUT IT WAS SUCCESSFUL IN THAT THEY DEVELOPED A STRAIN OF SIMIAN VIRUS THAT CAN KILL YOU IN A FEW DAYS VIA CANCER. THE CIA PRESUMABLY HAS THIS ABILITY RIGHT TO THIS DAY. WE KNOW THE NAMES OF THE RESEARCHERS WORKING ON THIS PROJECT. ONE OF THESE RESEARCHERS WAS A PROFESSOR WHO WAS BLOWN TO PIECES BY AN ELECTRIC SHOCK. ANOTHER WAS A YOUNG WOMAN WHO WAS A GIRLFRIEND OF LEE HARVEY OSWALD AND IS STILL ALIVE.

    IF YOU THINK THIS ALL SOUNDS FUNNY YOU MUST REMEMBER THAT THIS IS THE PUBLIC SECTOR. AND WE CAN EXPECT ALL SORTS OF MAXWELL SMART SHENANIGANS FROM THESE PEOPLE. THEY EVEN TRIED EXPLODING CIGARS! DID YOU KNOW THAT? THIS IS KNOWN HISTORY YOU DUMB GOOK. THERE IS NO USE BEING IN DENIAL OF IT.

    “DR MARY” SHERMAN IN THIS STORY WAS A FRIEND OF THE FAMILY OF EDWARD HASLAM. WHEN SHE WAS ELECTROCUTED THE MATTER WAS COVERED UP. SO HE SPENT HIS TIME INVESTIGATING HER MURDER, OR AT LEAST THE COVERUP ASSOCIATED WITH HER DEATH. HIS FINDINGS ARE CONFIRMED IN A BOOK CALLED “ME AND LEE” BY LEE OSWALDS GIRLFRIEND. ALSO A RESEARCHER ON THIS CANCER PROJECT. NOTE THAT THE FACTS INVOLVED WERE ALSO CONFIRMED IN THE MOVIE JFK, WITH ALL THOSE RATS IN CAGES IN THE HOUSE OF THE JOE PESCI CHARACTER. THIS WAS NOT MOVIE DIRECTORS LICENSE. BUT THE REALITY OF WHAT HAPPENED. DAVID FERRIE WAS WORKING WITH LEE OSWALD AND THE OTHERS.

  61. OK, I’m not going to get drawn in to an off-topic birther-ism debate, but suffice it to say that your fever dreams about “Barry Soetoro” and “question[s] of [Obama’s] eligibility” are simultaneously irrelevant, unsubstantiated, and contradicted by all of the available evidence.

    NO THATS ALL WRONG. CLEARLY YOU HAVEN’T LOOKED AT THE EVIDENCE.

    Back on topic, I’m far from convinced that the stock sale shows anything at all. It was about $2 million worth of stock owned by a man who earns $6 million a year, and it was about 1/3rd of his holdings.

    ITS EVIDENCE. ITS NOT CONCLUSIVE ON ITS OWN. IF YOU ARE LOOKING FOR ANY ONE FACTOID TO BE CONCLUSIVE EVIDENCE OF A CONSPIRACY THEN YOU DON’T UNDERSTAND CONSPIRACIES. CONSPIRACIES ARE UNDERTAKEN WITH THE MAIN GOAL OF “GETTING AWAY WITH IT” SO NO MATTER HOW CLUMSY AND INCOMPETENT THESE PEOPLE ARE THEY AREN’T ABOUT TO GIVE THEMSELVES AWAY WITH ANY ONE THING.

    Mark me down for coincidence until there is some kind of corroborating evidence of foul play.

    THERE IS CORROBORATING EVIDENCE. YOU MENTIONING ONE ITEM DOESN’T MAKE ALL THE OTHER ITEMS DISAPPEAR.

    $2 million is chump change compared to the ultimate cost of this thing. Further evidence that it wasn’t shady: no one at any of the institutional shareholders who have lost $$billions has killed him yet.

    HOW ABOUT THE 250 MILLION PLUS IN THE GOLDMAN SACHS SALES. MORE CHUMP CHANGE? ITS EVIDENCE. AGAIN NOT CONCLUSIVE EVIDENCE ON ITS OWN. IT ADDS TO THE EVIDENCE OF THE BOSSES SALES.

    I’ve seen plenty of independently-captured helicopter footage of the accident site to show that there is far more than one ship there.

    RIGHT. I SAW ALSO A FEW SHIPS THERE. NOT MAKING A DENT ON THE PROBLEM. BUT AT LEAST THERE IS A FEW THERE. YOU WOULD WISH FOR A LOT MORE.

    If you can find current satellite photos showing otherwise, that would be interesting. Hearsay recollections from an unnamed “one fellow”, however, are not.

    Containing something like this isn’t nearly as easy as you are making it out to be. Nothing is easy at those depths.

    IT OUGHT TO BE EASY IF YOU ARE PREPARED IN ADVANCE. THAT THE SCREWUP HAPPENED IN THE FIRST PLACE IS ITSELF PRETTY SUSPICIOUS.

    When there is real evidence to be had, why rely on one unnamed fellow? Put up the satellite photos or a wager big enough to motivate me to go down there and film it myself, or don’t make the claim. Have pilot’s license, will travel.

    WELL WE HAVE TWO ITEMS OF EVIDENCE IN THIS POST ALONE.

    Again, who exactly is supposed to be benefiting from this and how?

    THOSE WHO WISH TO GET THE CURRENT LEGISLATION THROUGH. THOSE WHO HAVE BANKED EVERYTHING ON THE CO2-FRAUD.

    And here’s the really key point: what’s in it for BP to motivate them to actively participate in this “false flag” operation?

    WE ARE NOT SAYING THAT ALL SHAREHOLDERS ARE INVOLVED. WE WANT TO LOOK AT THE INDIVIDUALS WHO BENEFIT. WHICH NEED NOT BE THE SAME AS THE COMPANY IN QUESTION.

    Losing billions of dollars, their entire reputation, and possible bankruptcy? Tempting offer, eh? Wouldn’t Hayward have been more likely to ask the nefarious “perps” for a few hundred million in cash and safe passage to a fancy and well guarded compound in South America than to simply sell $2 million in the stock of the company he was helping to destroy from the inside? At a minimum, find at least one BP whistleblower claiming it is a “false flag” operation.

    THIS IS A SITUATION WHERE THE AIR HASN’T YET CLEARED. AS OPPOSED TO THE JFK HIT, WHICH AFTER 47 YEARS IS CUT AND DRIED. AND THE 9/11 CONSPIRACY, WHICH IS NOW TO THE POINT OF US KNOWING THE HOW, BUT NOT THE WHO. IF YOU HAVEN’T SORTED OUT THE REALITY OF THE 9/11 CONSPIRACY THEN I WOULDN’T EXPECT YOU TO JUMP TO THE CONCLUSION OF A CONSPIRACY HERE. SINCE IF YOU DON’T THINK THERE IS A MYSTERY OVER WHO DID 9/11 YOU CANNOT POSSIBLY FIND THE IDEA OF A SIMILAR ROGUES GALLERY PULLING OFF THIS MORE CURRENT SABOTAGE. I WOULDN’T SUSPECT A RAT IF I HADN’T LOOKED IN TO 9/11 EITHER. A MASSIVE UNDERTAKING LIKE 9/11 POINTS TO A HUGE SHADOW GOVERNMENT INVOLVING AGENTS IN MANY DEPARTMENTS, COVERT OPS, THE FED, BANKING AND SO FORTH. SO IF YOU HAVEN’T INTERPOLATED A SHADOW ORGANISATION OF THIS SORT OF COURSE SABOTAGE IS UNREALISTIC TO YOU. I WOULDN’T EXPECT ANYTHING DIFFERENT.

    I’LL SAY IT OUTRIGHT:

    ” ITS ILLOGICAL TO THINK THAT THIS WAS SABOTAGE UNLESS YOU HAVE ALREADY CONCLUDED THAT THERE IS A SHADOW GOVERNMENT WHO PULLED OFF 9/11″

    OKAY? SO YOU ARE NOT BEING ILLOGICAL. THE ONE EVENT RELATES DIRECTLY TO THE OTHER. THE EXISTENCE OF THIS QUASI-ORGANISATION IS NECESSARY FOR THE IDEA OF SABOTAGE TO BE PLAUSIBLE.

    SO THE CHAIN OF THOUGHT THAT YOU ARE WORKING WITH IS NOT ILLOGICAL. THATS NOT WHAT I’M SAYING. BUT ONCE WE KNOW THAT THERE IS INDEED THIS QUASI-ORGANISATION AT WORK THEN CERTAIN THINGS FOLLOW FROM THAT.

    “Global warming fraud”? Sorry, no. I’ve worked on modeling,

    HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

    NOW YOU ARE BEING ILLOGICAL. MODELING ISN’T EVIDENCE FOR ANYTHING EXCEPT FOR THE PROPOSITION: BULLSHIT IN-BULLSHIT OUT.

    I’ve seen and understood the evidence, and it’s pretty nearly bulletproof from end-to-end.

    ITS MANIFEST THAT YOU HAVE NOT IF YOU HAVE FALLEN FOR THE GLOBAL WARMING FRAUD.

    Again, off topic though. It would be easier to follow your “logic” if you could focus on one evidence-free conspiracy theory at a time.

    NO THATS WRONG. AS EXPLAINED. THE IDEA OF CONSPIRACY IN THIS AREA IS INCOMPREHENSIBLE WITHOUT UNDERSTANDING OF THE REALITY OF CONSPIRACY IN 9/11. AND I DON’T EXPECT YOU TO THINK OTHERWISE. IF YOU WANT TO FIND OUT MORE YOUR NEXT PORT OF CALL IS A REVIEW OF 9/11 EVIDENCE. I CANNOT PROVE EVEN THE LIKELIHOOD OF SABOTAGE TO ANYONE WHO HASN’T REVIEWED 9/11.

    GOOD POINTS STILL ON THE BASIS OF LOGIC. EXCEPT FOR YOU NOT SEEING THROUGH THE CO2-FRAUD.

  62. Actually you need to make a port-of-call earlier than 9/11. Because it is the Kennedy hit “The Big Event”, that shows that BIG CONSPIRACIES are possible.

    You wouldn’t think that Big conspiracies were possible. For 8 years I laboured under the notion that Big Conspiracies were impossible so I therefore concluded that 9/11 was foreign regime action.

    So your order of investigation would be

    1. The Kennedy hit. To see that big conspiracies are possible.

    2. 9/11 … to show that a quasi-shadow government exists.

    3. Then this current (I say) sabotage. Since without 1 and 2 the idea of 3 is totally implausible. You see? I admit it. That the oil spill was sabotage is entirely implausible without one having first come to accept 1 & 2. No question about that at all.

    What seems to have happened is that these guys are emboldened by getting away with 9/11 and the great global banking ripoff. They are also in a panic over what otherwise would look to be the impending collapse of their global warming racket.

  63. Here is corroboration of the facts described by Edward Haslam in “Dr Mary’s Monkey.” You cannot get better corroboration than this: First-Hand on-camera testimony. You tell me if you think that Judith Vary Baker is making it all up:

  64. I’m sorry, but merely chanting the mantra “garbage-in, garbage-out” does nothing to detract from the fact that models can be, have been, and are being used for attribution studies

    SO FUCKING WHAT. THE MODELS ARE USELESS. ANY MODEL BASED AROUND CO2 HAVING A MORE THAN NEGLIGIBLE EFFECT IS USELESS. THAT IDIOTS PICK THEM UP FOR ATTRIBUTION STUDIES DOESN’T MEAN THEY ARE EVIDENCE FOR ANYTHING.

    which convincingly, resoundingly, and robustly detect an influence of anthropogenic greenhouse gas emissions on global temperatures.

    NO-ONE HAS DETECTED ANY SUCH INFLUENCE. YOU HAVE NO EVIDENCE YOU ARE LYING.

    ARE YOU IN FACT RELYING ON GODDARD RIGGED FIGURES? IS THAT WHERE THINGS ARE GOING WRONG? YOU CANNOT RELY ON RIGGED FIGURES. YOUR MODELS HAVE TO BACKTEST TO WHERE GODDARD AND HADLEY ARE NOT ABLE TO RIG THE FIGURES.

  65. If the safety valve was damaged as the survivor said to 60 minutes, (because of a rigger’s error and negligence presumingly) and they had prior to this been instructed to increase their productivity, the sale of the shares by Goldman Sachs and Hayward et al, could have been a precautionary measure, just in case they had to shut down the rig for repairs.

    O/T Red Adair is dead by the way?

    Thanks Ritchie for that reference, I hadn’t heard of it. But – the lead up of the explosion selling shares (that I believe can be backdated?) seems
    somewhat strange, don’t you agree? No doubt if they had decided to shut down the rig, would have effected the share price too.

    Now were the rig operators told to make repairs
    etc., and didn’t. Are those in charge still alive?
    We have just one survivor who says they were directed by BP not to stop drilling and investigate
    the fault in A SAFETY VALVE?

    What makes this all subject to serious investigation is did they still operate with faulty and potentially dangerous equipment. Safety valves are there to prevent malfunctions.

    To me not being an oil exploration expert the gas
    being produced must have built up and ignited. A load hissing noise and vibrations was heard by the survivor prior to the explosion, and also by the nearby anglers near the spot.

  66. The Three Mile Island incident occurred 12 days after the release of The China Syndrome (decent movie, incidentally). Coincidence? Or another conspiracy? The same conspirators?

    THE THREE MILE ISLAND INCIDENT WASN’T A PROBLEM. IT WAS PROOF THAT THE NUCLEAR STATIONS SAFETY FEATURES WORKED WELL. NO-ONE WAS INJURED.

    Who are these shadowy, nameless individuals who are secretly making an untold fortune selling tiny amounts of renewable energy who just need to take down the fossil fuel extraction industry so they can make trillions more? How in hell are they bankrolling this operation? Name names.

    I DON’T KNOW WHO THEY ARE. BUT THEY MUST BE THERE. THE THREE BUILDINGS OF THE WTC DIDN’T FALL DOWN BY THEMSELVES.

  67. Well there is a good report on the CBS 60 minutes, and the Australian 60 minutes featured MIKE WILLIAMS one of the survivors who jumped 10 stories into the sea. As he is featured in this also but more of him. In Text and video. Very illuminating. Read and view.

    I advise you to all look at this first without making
    assumptions. However, I am now trying to Google the selling of shares. Seems about the time of this disaster the Transocean riggers had drilled another much deeper hole now why would Goldman Sachs sell out when another much deeper hole was going to be capped.

  68. Well the series of events seem to suggest, a bloody big stuff up safety wise and Tony Hayward and Goldman Sachs have some strange reactions when it appears their investments are going to soar.

    Read the text attached to the CBS 60 minutes. They had been celebrating about a new drilling venture adjacent to the rig. Arguments were heard between the Transocean boss and the BP boss about procedures to be taking. Seems this new hole was 13,000 feet deeper?

    Tony Hayward did sell 2/3rds of his BP stock prior to this disaster, and Goldman Sachs sold
    4.5 million out of their 6 million shares.

    Why would you do that when a deeper hole had just been drilled? Of course there could be another explanation not connected to disaster.

    It was Tony Hayward who said, he wanted it settled so he could get ‘his life back’. Obama responded by saying ‘He wouldn’t be working for me after comments like this.”

    Yes Graeme anyone who doesn’t think, something doesn’t gel, doesn’t know GS who are the biggest investment bank in Carbon Trading and Green Energy. Al Gore’s mates, too. Now Al Gore seems to have finished his marriage to go off with someone who ain’t completely feminine, so the gossip is saying.

    People are suggesting that this will now make the Cap ‘N Trade more likely in the US of A.

    No wonder that Obama looks stunned.

  69. Yeah bunny-honey. Its completely suspect. But people who haven’t seen how 9/11 came down may recognise that things don’t look quite right.

    But they aren’t going to think too much of it. They are just going to put it down to coincidence. And its not necessarily them being stupid.

    Whereas with 9/11 we have all the evidence we need to the nth degree. So when we see something suspicious like this, naturally we are NOT going to think, that the same shadow government that brought the three buildings down, have dissolved and gone about their innocent private businesses.

    Nor would we see this all as a separate and distinct thing from the massive global banking theft off the rest of society that has taken place since 2008.

    Nor would we see it as a thing entirely independent of the relentless global warming fraud.

    I’m only really faulting Douglas on the global warming fraud. He really ought to know better where that story is concerned.

  70. Here is the CO2 record, from about 1812 to 1960. Thereafter the record is turned over to people so stupid that they set up there testing near to the largest active volcano on earth. Allowing then any number of excuses to fudge the data. Of course air traffic over these islands has increased out of all reckoning since that station was set up. But never mind.

    We have the figures from 1812 to 1960. So lets see you go to work with your robust model and your Data and Attribution, now that I’ve presented you with one half of the data you need.

    Going from that CO2 record you ought to be able to spit out an artificial temperature record. Then we might compare it to the various rigged temperature records that are out there on the net.

  71. “Tony Hayward did sell 2/3rds of his BP stock prior to this disaster, and Goldman Sachs sold
    4.5 million out of their 6 million shares.

    Why would you do that when a deeper hole had just been drilled? Of course there could be another explanation not connected to disaster.”

    Its much stronger evidence than people would give it credit for. What pressing cash needs did Hayward have?

    They don’t pay him well at BP? As the worldwide boss for the 5th largest corporation on earth? What were his particular cash needs back then that he found so pressing?

  72. He’s paid 4 million a year they say? Not sure if that’s pounds or dollars, but he has met some Russian
    big wig to arrange oil in Russia from BP?

    Got to do my essay now Graeme for tomorrow
    on organic Parsley growing commercially.

  73. From Ritchies cut and paste:

    “In the initial stages of the spill, an estimated 30,000 barrels of oil per day were flowing from the well. In July 1979, the pumping of mud into the well reduced the flow to 20,000 barrels per day, and early in August the pumping of nearly 100,000 steel, iron, and lead balls into the well reduced the flow to 10,000 barrels per day.”

    Lead balls hey? That looks like the deal right there.

  74. Notice that NOAA is roped into the dodgy behavior. NOAA being one of the outfits involved in the global warming fraud, and here they are showing up in this scandal as trying to hide evidence.

  75. How is the stupidity of banning offshore drilling at this time? You want the opposite. You want other oil companies coming in and homesteading BP’s property. You want a whole lot of drills going down and sucking up as much oil as possible to relieve the pressure.

    Sending oil-drilling jackals in would be the equivalent of drilling “relief wells”.

    Its always better to have greed working on your side.

  76. Mr B

    Hi it’s Ron here.

    Have a squizz at this:

    http://www.pennenergy.com/index/power/renewable-generation/display/2150155536/articles/powergenworldwide/renewables/geothermal/2010/06/kenya-receives__330m.html

    I think the Kenyan Involvement Paradigm should at this time be invoked for the purposes of Refinement and Ranking.

    Obviously the Kenyans are going to make out like Bandits once Cap and Trade is introduced

    So what we need to do is get people out there scouting around the dive shops, to see if there are reports of Kenyans taking scuba lessons before the leak started.

  77. Righteous. Now here is something pretty good. Before the sabotage a Goldman Sachs executive emails his girlfriend. He’s bragging that they are in the process of “shorting the Gulf”. Fundamentally, prior to the accident, he tells his girlfriend triumphantly that the birds and the fishes can suck shit.
    >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

    NEW YORK (The Borowitz Report) – In what is looming as another public relations predicament for Goldman Sachs, the banking giant admitted today that it made “a substantial financial bet against the Gulf of Mexico” one day before the sinking of an oil rig in that body of water.

    The new revelations came to light after government investigators turned up new emails from Goldman employee Fabrice “Fabulous Fab” Tourre in which he bragged to a girlfriend that the firm was taking a “big short” position on the Gulf.

    “One oil rig goes down and we’re going to be rolling in dough,” Mr. Tourre wrote in one email. “Suck it, fishies and birdies!”

    Fabulous Fabrice a gifted soothsayer?

  78. Naturally in a few weeks time there will be all sorts of debunking youtubes and links. There will be all sorts of claims that the emails came out afterwards. It will never end the smoke-blowing.

    It has to be that way because sabotage is a done deal on the sayso of Fabulous Fabrice alone.

  79. BP on its own doesn’t have what it takes to force-feed the media like what is being attempted here. BP is a private foreign company. It cannot exercise police power.

    This is so much covert ops. Just listen to what has been going on from a media management point of view? The police power is intimidating all the locals. The descriptions are consistent with a picture of wall-to-wall special ops types in local good-ole-boy clobber.

  80. Mr B

    Hi it’s Ron here.

    Those emails are sickening.

    I have to say that the Jew Borowitz is pretty good Investigative Reporter.

    Do you think it’s worth flicking him the Dago’s details so he can do a bit of sniffing around?

    • Sure. It cannot do any harm. He could find out who the wops broker is and trace it back to a major bank-share-pyramiding ring.

      You see Ron. There are many many patriotic and righteous Jews. You shouldn’t be putting them all down the way you are.

  81. Mr B

    The Jew Borowitz has an opinion poll up on his website.

    Rand Paul is doing good!!!!

    http://www.borowitzreport.com/2010/05/22/poll-rand-paul-surges-ahead-of-palin-among-voters-who-describe-themselves-as-morons/

    • Evidence that this fellows hooked nose veers to our left.

  82. Ho ho. Check this out below Ron.

    Cambria is not above the old “play-dumb-and-stall” tactic.

  83. Graeme, Michael Moore in his film “Capitalism: A Love Story” interviews a number of Democrats with excellent credentials who claim the anti-popular turn around by congressional Democrats in the second vote that permitted selected bank bailouts in the face of overwhelming popular opposition to this course was evidence or the result of an orchestrated financial coup perpetrated by a shadow government serving the needs of the big banks and financial institutions such as Goldman Sachs.

    • Right. Well I agree with him. People were calling in at maybe 500-to-1 against the bailout. Then the first vote failed. Immediately they rigged up a second vote after Goldman Sachs bribed all the potential swing voters.

      • Yes, there was massive popular opposition to the bailout and reps knew this since they’d been bombarded from the grassroots by citizens urging Democrats to vote No to the bank bailouts. Which they respectfully did, the first time.

        The turnaround in quick order is inexplicable other than in the context of some sort of undefined, murky, external, anti-democratic, coercive political interference within the American polity on behalf of the corporate ruling elite and their minority interests, epitomised by Goldman Sachs, Halliburton, et al.

      • Its all about bribes and payoffs, organized in pre-meditated blitzkrieg fashion. The likes of which no-one without backing in government and media could hope to get away with.

  84. YOU IDIOT. OLBERMANN IS CLOSE TO SOURCE ON THIS ONE. INTERVIEWING AN EYEWITNESS IN PERSON. DON’T BE A BLOCKHEAD AND SIMPLY LISTEN TO WHAT HIS WITNESS HAS TO SAY.

    FUCKING HELL YOU DUMB WOP. PUT SOME EPISTEMOLOGY TOGETHER. AN EYEWITNESS ON-LOCATION, WHO IS NOT HERSELF A MEDIA HACK, IS THE BEST SORT OF REPORTING YOU CAN GET. I’LL NOT VOUCH FOR OLBERMANNS EDITORIALS. I WILL VOUCH FOR AN INTERVIEW OF AN EYEWITNESS, NOT A MEDIA-HACK, ON LOCATION. GET YOUR ACT TOGETHER.

    I WOULDN’T HAVE INCLUDED IT IF IT WERE MERELY OLBERMANN RANTING OR TALKING TO MRS HUFFINGTON OR SOME SUCH OTHER JIVE.

    • I find your post offensive. Stop using capitals this via email mean shouting and raging.

      You are to me a raging twit… that needs to take your medication to calm down and become rational, I don’t know how Graeme allows you to post, it is not
      constructive or adding to this general theme of this blog.

      Sorry Birdy, I have a thing about people or posters using capitals.

      • Sorry Bush Bunny. What happens is these guys come in writing fairly nasty emails so I write over them. I use capitals to show that its me and not them.

  85. It turns out that the Borowitz story is not to be relied upon. Or it might be that its true but to release the news they had to run it through a comedian.

    Not only did Goldman Sachs sell huge amounts of BP Stock. But they also shorted TransOcean stock days before the event.

    Here’s what my link says:

    However, just because his piece was satire, doesn’t mean there isn’t something to it. The reason humor is funny is because it lampoons reality, providing an exaggerative and simplified caricature to bring out the key issues in a non-threatening way. Historically, especially in times of heavy oppression, the best truth tellers have been the comedians. Benjamin Franklin certainly used humor to his advantage in helping to win America’s Independence.

    A. True Ott, Ph.D., wrote the following to me last night:

    “I have confirmed that there were indeed numerous “shorts” placed on TransOcean stock just days before the “problem”. Was it Goldman Sachs? That is yet to be conclusively determined (there is indeed a SEC investigation ongoing) — but labeling something as “satire” is a lawyer’s shrewd trick to keep from being sued for slander — even if it is all true. Moreover, there were massive shorts placed literally seconds after the news hit the airwaves. ”

    Who would dare to quote the actual e-mails from “Fabulous Fab”, unless the writer would post them as a “satire” – especially after what happened to the Wall Street Journal writers who dared expose the 9-11 short sales involving Goldman Sachs.

    (They were assigned to Afghanistan, and had fatal “accidents” there.)

    Dr. Ott has subsequently confirmed from two sources that Goldman Sachs was indeed in on the shorts being placed on TransOcean stock.

    (See Email from Don Nicoloff documenting Goldman Sachs short puts on TransOcean stock.)

    And he has confirmed that the comedian was aware of that as well.

    Dr. Ott had me and Paul Noel on his two-hour radio show yesterday talking about the viral article we posted
    >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

    http://pesn.com/2010/05/05/9501645_No_joke–Goldman_Sachs_shorted_TransOcean/

    This article comes from Sterling D Allan

    CEO of Pure Energy Systems News.

  86. Well Mr B.

    So it turns out that the Jew Borowitz is himself doing a bit of Front-Running on the Goldman Sachs False-Flag operation.

    Now this is a textbook Double-Reverse Switcheroo.

    Any time from now on that you advance a false flag Paradigm for the Gulf the Shamestream Media will say “oh you got duped by the Jew Borowitz – no story – move on – cap and trade – carbon tax”.

    So he has given Goldman Sachs and the Kenyans the green light. Carte blanche.

    I told you you couldn’t trust the Jew. But you said “oh no Ron don’t worry he’s a GOOD JEW”.

    But it turns out that Borowitz is just Running Interference for GS and the Kenyans.

    I hate to say it, Mr B, and no disrespect intended, but “I told you so”.

  87. Heh babe I was hiking today and listening to an interview with Shane White a history professor from Sydney Uni who grew up in NZ. He’s been studying and writing about African American New York history for ages.

    Anyways, he was fascinating not least because he sounds in speech exactly like you. I wonder if he came from the same part of NZ as you did. Honestly, he sounds so like you it’s uncanny.

    You can hear him here.

    http://www.abc.net.au/classic/throsby/

    • Thanks for that Philomena. Yeah he’ll have that NewZealand style of talking mixed up with the semi-ebonics I seem to have developed from the likes of Big Al Mustafa; a character in the movie “The Enforcer.”

      I’ll listen to him straight away.

  88. Indeed. I think the Borowitz Episode is proof of the Conspiracy.

    If there was no Conspiracy, why would they have to go with the old Double Reverse Switcheroo?

    Hebrews are so predictable.

    • Right. If we see a lot more of this sort of thing that does serve to give it the mark of sabotage. But you ought not rule out at this point that he might not be on the money. It will take awhile for the smoke to clear.

      So for example there is this story about the burst being volcanic. Cambria picked up on it. Someone else says the volcanic mud volcano is twenty miles away? Why all the confusion?

      Smoke-blowing.

      We now have rumours that its far far more serious then people are letting on, simultaneous with stories that its far less of a problem then what people are letting on. The idea is just to wear everyone down and have all the conspirationally minded go off in a number of tangents, and hitch their wagon to various wrong stories.

  89. Video footage of Gaza flotilla attack.

    http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2010/jun/11/gaza-flotilla-attack-new-video

    • I’ll have to really focus on that one Philomena. I’ll watch it very carefully over the next couple of days and let you know what I think. Whether it could be a premeditated setup. Or whether its a fair indication of what really happened.

      Its not something I would want to make a snap judgement on. Both sides in that particular conflict are advanced media manipulaters. Moreso even the Muslim side in my view. But I’ll look at it very seriously. It may simply be too hard to call.

  90. Cambria is so desperate he would suck the cock of his neighbour’s dog if he thought it would get him $ returns.

    As we all know betting on the movement of shadows, on nothing, is a fool’s game and anti-social. Limited brain dead jerks like Joe Cambria are worse than useless to themselves and to humanity. That’s their legacy.

    • I like all your posts Philomena. Particularly this one. However I’m not sure I can leave this one up for too long.

      • I see you have been inspired in your video choice by the historian Shane White.

      • Yes. I love Shane White and Miles Davis and Graeme Bird.

        Bad, ain’t I.

    • OTOH, how cool, sexy and fecund are these dudes.

  91. Birdie,

    Fish gotta swim
    Birds gotta fly

  92. “Going from that CO2 record you ought to be able to spit out an artificial temperature record.”

    Um, no? This is incredibly disingenuous. There are lots of other inputs.

    WELL YOU OUGHT TO HAVE THE OTHER INPUTS TO HAND. WHY DON’T YOU HAVE ALL THE OTHER INFORMATION TO HAND?

    Not to mention (and this is a point that critics seem to miss all the time), the models predict CLIMATE not WEATHER.

    YOU ARE LYING DOUGLAS. YOUR MODEL PREDICTS NOTHING AT ALL. YOU OUGHT TO MAKE YOUR POSTS SHORTER FROM NOW ON. BECAUSE ONCE SOMEONE STARTS LYING THEIR POST GETS WIPED. THE MODELS PREDICT NOTHING. TO SAY OTHERWISE IS A LIE.

    Expecting one model run to predict annual or decadal scale wiggles in the temperature record is stupid, since that’s not what they are for.

    WHAT ARE THEY GOOD FOR THEN? THEY DON’T PREDICT WEATHER. THEY DON’T PREDICT CLIMATE. WHAT ARE THEY GOOD FOR? WHAT IS IT THAT YOU CLAIM THEY CAN DO? YOU MUST BE ASSUMING THEY CAN PREDICT SOMETHING.

    Instead, they are run MANY TIMES to produce an ENSEMBLE of model runs, which taken as a whole are very, very good at predicting CLIMATE over 20-50 year time scales,

    WELL DO THAT THEN. TAKE THE REAL DATA. MAKE AN ENSEMBLE OF MODEL RUNS. AVERAGE THOSE RUNS. AND TELL ME WHAT YOU GET. THE WHOLE PROCESS SHOULD BE AUTOMATED BY NOW. WHY CAN YOU NOT HAVE YOUR MODEL MAKE TWENTY RUNS AND AVERAGE IT? TOO DIFFICULT FOR THE PUBLIC SERVICE”

    CLEARLY THE REAL REASON WHY YOU CANNOT GET YOUR MODEL TO DO THIS IS THAT ITS USELESS AT PREDICTING CLIMATE OVER 20 TO 50 YEARS. CLEARLY YOU MODEL IS ABSOLUTELY USELESS FOR THIS PURPOSE.

    HOW MANY IS “AN ENSEMBLE”. SOUNDS ENTIRELY UNSCIENTIFIC. SO YOU RUN THE MODEL HOW MANY TIMES? AND THEN YOU AVERAGE IT? WHY IS NOT THIS REPEATED RUNS AND AVERAGING NOT AUTOMATED IF YOU RECKON IT WORKS. THE REASON IS IT DOESN’T WORK AND YOUR CROWD WANT TO BE ABLE TO FAKE UP THE PREDICTIVE PROCESS.

    AND THEN YOU RECKON ITS GOOD FOR 20-50 YEARS? NOT THATS BULLSHIT. BUT PLUG THE THING IN ANYWAY AND SEE WHAT YOU COME OUT WITH, WITH THE REAL CO2 RECORD.

    and which unanimously predict significant warming.

    WELL THATS WRONG AGAIN. BECAUSE WE WILL COOL OVER THE NEXT 20 YEARS AND WILL NOT HAVE RECOVERED IN 50. BUT LETS SEE WHAT YOUR USELESS MODEL DOES TO THE HISTORICAL DATA.

    I’m sure you understand this, so why do you pretend not to?

    WHAT I KNOW FOR A FACT IS THAT YOUR MODEL IS USELESS AND CANNOT PREDICT ANYTHING.

    “Here is the CO2 record, from about 1812 to 1960.”

    Where? I don’t see a link.

    I MUST HAVE FORGOTTEN TO LINK THE CO2 RECORD. I WILL DO SO.

    “Thereafter the record is turned over to people so stupid that they set up there testing near to the largest active volcano on earth. Allowing then any number of excuses to fudge the data.”

    Asinine and unsubstantiated.

    WHAT DO YOU MEAN. THE MAIN TESTING SIGHT IS AT MOANA LOA.

    If they have been “fudging the data”, fucking go to Mauna Loa, do your own experiment to show what the CO2 concentration is there now, and fucking compare it to their numbers.

    WE CANNOT ALLOW THEIR DATA TO BE USED AT ALL. THEY SET UP NEXT TO A FUCKING ACTIVE VOLCANO. THEIR DATA IS OBVIOUSLY TO BE VOIDED.

    This would cost about 5 bucks.

    NO IT WOULDN’T FOR ME TO FLY TO HAWAII, TAKE YEARS OFF WORK. AND AUDIT THEIR DATA WOULD COST HUNDREDS OF THOUSANDS OF DOLLARS.

    Put up, or shut up.

    NO NO. YOU CANNOT USE RIGGED DATA DOUGLAS. YOU CANNOT SET UP A TESTING STATION NEXT TO THE WORLDS LARGEST ACTIVE VOLCANO. THE DATA IS VOID.

    If you have a problem with the data, demonstrate it.

    YOU CANNOT SET UP A TESTING STATION NEXT TO THE WORLDS LARGEST ACTIVE VOLCANO DOUGLAS. THIS IS NOT SCIENCE. ITS FRAUD.

    Don’t whine about pretend data tampering because it is easier, do the legwork and tell us what the real current concentration is.

    NO NO. YOU CANNOT USE RIGGED DATA. YOU CANNOT SET UP A TESTING STATION NEXT TO THE WORLDS LARGEST ACTIVE VOLCANO.

    What’s that? Pretty much the same there as everywhere else on the planet, within a few ppm or so? Huh. Maybe the volcanic influence isn’t what you thought it was, eh? Maybe the troposphere is a little better mixed than you thought, eh? Volcanic CO2 fluxes are nothing compared to the biosphere, and there’s even less than nothing to indicate that volcanic CO2 fluxes have been rising lately. The Mauna Loa record can clearly resolve the biosphere’s seasonal effect on CO2 (the Northern hemisphere has higher primary productivity). How can this be possible if local (!) volcanic or jet (!!!! wtf?!) emissions are responsible? If it is tampering, it should only take you a few samples spread across a year to demonstrate it.

    WELL I BELIEVE IT HAS BEEN DEMONSTRATED, OR ELSE WHY ALL THE WHINING ABOUT CHEMICAL TESTING? WHENEVER THE CHEMICAL TESTING SHOWS THEM TO BE SUSPECT THERE IS ALL THIS WHINING ABOUT CHEMICAL TESTING BEING NO GOOD.

    If you think that’s the case, you owe it to the world to FUCKING DEMONSTRATE IT!

    NO NO. YOU CANNOT USE RIGGED DATA. YOU CANNOT SET UP A TESTING STATION NEXT TO THE BIGGEST ACTIVE VOLCANO ON THE PLANET. THATS REALLY THE END OF THE MATTER.

    The Mauna Loa record makes TESTABLE FUCKING CLAIMS ABOUT THE PRESENT!

    YOUR MODELS CANNOT PREDICT ANYTHING. THEY ARE ALWAYS WRONG. YOU HAVE THE HISTORICAL CO2 DATA. LETS SEE YOU USE IT.

    ITS NOT OKAY TO USE RIGGED DATA.

    • Here is the CO2 record

      Its easy enough to zoom in on it.

  93. Instead, they are run MANY TIMES to produce an ENSEMBLE of model runs, which taken as a whole are very, very good at predicting CLIMATE over 20-50 year time scales,

    So we have models constructed in the last 10 years, that he some how knows are “very, very good” at predicting over a 20-50 year time scale???

    How do you know this? They have never been tested on data that they aren’t calibrated to.

  94. The thing your missing is that the average of ensemble runs does not resemble any of the individual runs, in the same way that the “average weather” (in which it is about 40 degrees, rains about 15% of the time, etc) does not resemble “yesterday’s weather” (in which it was a spring 85 degrees, did not rain at all, etc). Asking to run the models backwards (which we have done) and perfectly simulate the weather of the past is foolish.

    SO YOUR MODELS DON’T BACKTEST, SO THEY ARE NO GOOD, SO THEY DON’T WORK. SIMPLE AS THAT.

    Running the models backwards produces a good model of the climate by averaging runs.

    BULLSHIT. YOU ARE LYING. LETS SEE YOU DO IT.

    (This has been and is being done all the time.) Running the models backwards emphatically does NOT produce an exact match for the historical temperature record.

    WELL THEN WHAT GOOD ARE THEY FOR. IF YOU CANNOT “PREDICT” WHAT WE ALREADY KNOW YOU CERTAINLY CANNOT PREDICT THE FUTURE. SO THE MODELS DON’T WORK. IF THEY DON’T BACKTEST THEY DON’T WORK.

    What you are missing is that it isn’t even intended too.

    SO THEY DON’T WORK. THEY AREN’T EVEN INTENDED TO WORK.

    Easiest way to see this? The models are STOCHASTIC. Running them twice on the same data does not produce the same results, it produces two different results based on different rolls of the dice.

    THATS BECAUSE THE MODELS DON’T WORK.

    If you don’t understand even this basic point, I suggest you google the term “Monte Carlo simulation” and start reading from the beginning, as this is a day 1 lesson.

    ITS NOT ABOUT US NOT UNDERSTANDING. WE UNDERSTAND ONLY TOO WELL. YOU HAVE A MODEL, AND IT DOESN’T WORK.

    Steve Edney gets it, he asked:

    “So we have models constructed in the last 10 years, that he some how knows are “very, very good” at predicting over a 20-50 year time scale???

    How do you know this? They have never been tested on data that they aren’t calibrated to.”

    Steve, we know this exactly the way that Graeme (somewhat mistakenly, since he is asking for weather) suggests that we should: by running the models on historical data.

    NO NO. I’M ASKING FOR THE CLIMATE AND THE TEMPERATURE. AND YOUR MODEL CANNOT PREDICT THE CLIMATE OR AVERAGED TEMPERATURES.

    Graeme, you are making a totally unfounded assumption that the volcano makes a difference! It’s testable whether it does or doesn’t, has been tested, and it doesn’t.

    If it did, one of the many dozens of well-funded think tanks who agree with you would have long ago sent someone to Mauna Loa to do the measurements themselves.

    NO YOU DON’T SET UP A TESTING STATION NEXT TO THE BIGGEST ACTIVE VOLCANO IN THE WORLD. THATS AMATEUR HOUR. THATS FRAUD.

    The volano is a red herring. Yes, volcanoes collectively emit a moderate amount of CO2. Yes, Mauna Loa emits some CO2. YES, THE TROPOSPHERE IS WELL-MIXED. YES, WE OBTAIN SIMILAR CONCENTRATIONS EVERYWHERE. YES, THAT INCLUDES PLACES FAR FROM VOLCANOES AND CIVILIZATION, LIKE ANTARCTICA.

    YOU OBTAIN SIMILAR RESULTS ELSEWHERE THROUGH A NOAA MONOPOLY. A MONOPOLY THAT ADMITS TO MESSING WITH ITS OWN SOURCE DATA. AND IN THE CONTEXT OF VIGOROUS PUTDOWNS TO CHEMICAL TESTING. IN A CONTEXT WHERE THE CHEMICAL TESTING IS IN DISAGREEMENT, OR THERE WOULD NOT HAVE BEEN THE EITHER-OR BICKERING ABOUT THE TESTING METHOD. FURTHERMORE NOAA SIGNS ON TO THE SAME RIGGED DATA AS HADLEY AND GODDARD. OBVIOUSLY THEY ARE NOT TO BE TRUSTED.

    I notice you deleted the portion of my post taking issue with your “garbage in, garbage out” claim and providing a long list of historical successes of computer modeling.

    COMPUTER MODELS ARE NOT EVIDENCE FOR ANYTHING BUT GARBAGE IN GARBAGE OUT. FIND SOME REAL EVIDENCE. EVIDENCE IS DATA RELATED TO A SPECIFIC HYPOTHESIS THROUGH A PROCESS OF REASON. MODELS ARE PEOPLE PLAYING WITH A COMPUTER.

    A telling omission. Unwilling to disown all of the extremely useful computer models that work,

    THERE HAS NOT BEEN ANY USEFUL MODELING DONE YOU ARE LYING. YOUR MODELS DON’T EVEN BACKTEST, WHICH MEANS THEY DON’T WORK. THEY HAVE ALWAYS BEEN WRONG WITH THEIR PREDICTIONS.

    unwilling to admit that that shows modeling is a useful way to understand and predict complex systems, you decided to punt and hide the message. Very bold and manly.

    YOU HAVE NO EVIDENCE FOR THIS GLOBAL WARMING FRAUD. IF YOU HAD THE EVIDENCE YOU WOULD MAKE GOOD WITH IT.

  95. Steve, we know this exactly the way that Graeme (somewhat mistakenly, since he is asking for weather) suggests that we should: by running the models on historical data.

    The point I’m making is that no one serious about making predictive models has confidence in a model that is only tested on the data set you used to build the model.

    What I am suggesting is that while I encourage the building of these models – we have to have something to base our estimates, we don’t know that they are “very, very good”. Not yet, and we won’t for another good 20 years.

    • But Edney. You cannot encourage the building of the models tendentiously.

      The models are built on the basis that CO2 has a negligible effect. BUT IT DOESN’T. Thats a lie. There is no evidence for this lie.

      Now you can encourage the building of models. But ought not want them built on the basis of a lie!!!

      You see if they are public relations for a lie they ought not be built in the first place.

      If if I was supervising it, and could fire people that pissed me off …. and supposing also that amongst the software and quant. people I also had graduate students who knew how to bodgy-up fuzzy-logic algorithms ……

      ….

      Well then in a matter of weeks, I could have a number of dummy models up, that really COULD have a shot at predicting climate. And over time they would be able to predict the weather as well. Because THERE IS NO CUTOFF BETWEEN CLIMATE AND WEATHER.

      They scoff at you and say there is a difference between climate and weather. But there is not cutoff, just as there is no cutoff between short-run and long-run generally.

      Building models tendentiously is lying and ripping off the public. We are not interested in these modelers CREATING reality. We want to know what the reality is. And as soon as they mandate, in their models, that CO2 is a driving force, they are lying to the public. Since they have no evidence for it.

  96. The oil gush may never be stopped. Here’s why.

    http://www.theoildrum.com/node/6593#comment-648967

    • But Philomena. They can stop it with the Greed-based Graeme-Bird approach to homesteading. Since the government, and the people, will naturally incur costs on this matter it is only right that BP loses her pseudo-property rights over the situation

      We need an ungodly oil-drilling vampire-pack to descend on the area and get themselves their royalities-free fill of the planets blood-and-lubricant.

      You just call a royalties holiday and a free-for-all.

      THEY MOCKED ME THOUGH I LENT THEM MY INSPIRATION.

      They at Catallaxy mocked me. They mocked me. But in thinking about me they were inadvertently filled with the holy spirit of the webs most holistic prophet. And each of them tendered their answers to this problem, and I looked upon these answer and found them to be righteous.

      One said mass-sackings

      One said get money right and honest. Right being silver. Honest being gold.

      Another offered homesteading, another sea-steading.

      And another said that “lo’. The wound may have a pyramid as its bandage.”

      All mocked. Yet each spake only truth.

      Then the truth was emptied from their mouths. The inspiration that was mine, left them, and returned to its master.

  97. One of the greatest triumphs of computer modeling was leading to the discovery of chaos. It’s a very interesting phenomenon that can arise even in very simple (1-variable, deterministic, algebraic, LTI) systems. Read up on it, it’s fascinating.

    Start with this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chaos_theory#Sensitivity_to_initial_conditions (if the link doesn’t work, search for “sensitivity to initial conditions”). It will explain to you why it’s impossible to run models backwards with observed data and recover historical weather.

    IF YOU CANNOT DO THAT TO SOME LEVEL OF SATISFACTION YOUR MODELS ARE WORTHLESS. THE FACT IS YOUR MODELS ARE WORTHLESS. PIERS CORBYN AND OTHERS CAN PREDICT THE WEATHER. YOU CANNOT. YOU ARE NOT ENGAGED IN SCIENCE. YOU ARE JUST WASTING MONEY ON COMPUTERS. YOU HAVEN’T BEEN ABLE TO SHOW YOUR MODELS CAN DO ANYTHING. BY YOUR OWN ADMISSION THEY CANNOT, AND EVERY LAST DOLLAR SPENT ON YOUR PROJECT HAS BEEN TOTALLY WASTED.

    (Note that this does nothing to prevent us from recovering historical _climate_, which we can in fact do.) This corner of math is extremely counter-intuitive to the uninitiated, unfortunately.


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